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Reconsidering One of EGW's Key Prophecies


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For years, I have been denying that EGW is a "true" prophet. One of my biggest reasons for doing so has been her prediction that the Pope is the antichrist/beast/false prophet (I forget which one).  For years, I have held Islam as the number one suspect.  After seeing recent news about Pope Francis, I am reconsidering my opinion.  There is much this man says (including speaking "ex cathedra" or "infallibly" - like in his most recent encyclical)that sounds like the things that one would expect from one who has "two horns like a lamb and speaks like a dragon" (Rev. 13:11). The video below by a non SDA pastor is just an example of what many conservative congregations - including those among Catholics - are coming to believe.

Please do not take this post as being anti Catholic.  It is not; it is anti Pope Francis.  I grew up as a devout Catholic.  Most of my family and many of my closest friends are still Catholic.  If anything, this is a plea to devout, God-fearing Catholics to take a good look at the man currently leading their denomination; and choose this day whom you will serve.

 

 

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No one will take you as anti-catholic!! Personally I have never taken what people say about the Catholic people as being anti-catholic!! It has always been about the system not the people, because as we have heard and seen there will be many Sunday keepers in heaven!! They will probably be many we would've never thought would be there and vice-a-versa!!

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4 hours ago, JoeMo said:

Please do not take this post as being anti Catholic.  It is not; it is anti Pope Francis.  I grew up as a devout Catholic.  Most of my family and many of my closest friends are still Catholic.

There is a real difference in being anti-Catholic (anti-anything) when you are simply reporting what you have seen. Anti- comes into play when you begin to offend by degrading what you are reporting on. Unfortunately, many have missed that point.

Another problem comes when hearers get emotionally offended (triggered) by hearing truth. You can't help that!

https://www.facebook.com/realCharlieKirk/videos/363015501747696

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Pope Francis consistently reaches out to Islam; and has proclaimed on several occasions that Muslims are our brothers because both Christians and Muslims worship the same God and are all descendants of father Abraham. I strongly disagree with that statement.  Mark 3:25 tells us that a house divided against itself cannot stand. It makes no sense that the god of Islam (Allah) is also the God of Jews and Christians (Yahweh).  So could Allah command His people to destroy the people of Yahweh?  The Pope wants to see Christians and Muslims unite.  That would be wonderful if we all united under the banner of Christ; but Muslim leaders insist that we unite under the banner of Allah.  This is progressively evolving into a pseudo-denomination called "Chrislam", an alliance of misguided Christians and progressive Muslims.  Pope Francis encourages this.  Sorry, but my loyalty (and that of most Catholics and Adventists) is to the Father and the Lord Jesus; not to some former moon god whom half of the world has elevated to the office of supreme god. It reminds me of the OT scripture about Lucifer raising His throne above the heavens.

Francis is also a strong supporter of a one-world government and a one world religion.  Reminds me of some of the more intimidating parts of prophecy.

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On 10/17/2020 at 11:16 AM, JoeMo said:

It makes no sense that the god of Islam (Allah) is also the God of Jews and Christians (Yahweh).

Much of this is semantics. "Allah" is simply the Arabic word for "God". If you are an Arabic-speaking Christian, "Allah" is the word you would use for the Christian god.

While Christians and Muslims have drastically different conceptions of God, what does it mean to worship the same god or a different god? Christians believe that the trinitarian God is a reality, and that the god described in the Islamic texts doesn't exist. If Christianity is true, either the Muslims worship the same God, but have a misconception of His character and nature, or they worship a non-existent entity (in which case they are worshiping nothing). They can't worship a different God unless there exists more than one God. And if both "Yahweh" and "Allah" exist and are different gods, then Christianity is not true, since Christianity teaches that there is but one God (and Islam would not be true since Islam also teaches there is but one God).

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6 minutes ago, pierrepaul said:

Much of this is semantics. "Allah" is simply the Arabic word for "God". If you are an Arabic-speaking Christian, "Allah" is the word you would use for the Christian god.

While Christians and Muslims have drastically different conceptions of God, what does it mean to worship the same god or a different god? Christians believe that the trinitarian God is a reality, and that the god described in the Islamic texts doesn't exist. If Christianity is true, either the Muslims worship the same God, but have a misconception of His character and nature, or they worship a non-existent entity (in which case they are worshiping nothing). They can't worship a different God unless there exists more than one God. And if both "Yahweh" and "Allah" exist and are different gods, then Christianity is not true, since Christianity teaches that there is but one God (and Islam would not be true since Islam also teaches there is but one God).

I agree 100%, and I've mentioned that a number times!! I like your "conceptions of God!" That's exactly the difference!!

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24 minutes ago, pierrepaul said:

And if both "Yahweh" and "Allah" exist and are different gods, then Christianity is not true, since Christianity teaches that there is but one God (and Islam would not be true since Islam also teaches there is but one God).

Even the Bible talks about more than one god; but only one Supreme God.

"God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; He judgeth among the gods". (Ps. 81:1)

"“I said, ‘You are “gods”;
    you are all sons of the Most High.’
But you will die like mere mortals;
    you will fall like every other ruler.” (Ps. 81:6-7)

If you want to believe that Allah (or Dagon or Baal or Molech) are the same god as our Supreme, Most High God, IMHO you are deceived.  If Allah is the same god as Yahweh or Jehovah, why does he call for the death of all Christians and Jews; and call Friday the Sabbath?

I pray that the Supreme God reveal Himself in a mighty way to our Muslim brothers; and that they would worship Him with the same devotion they give to the false god Allah.

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I currently hold the position that all religions fail to take a universal view and are far too provincial in their outlook. This especially applies to the three mono-theistic religions, which all claim a "universal god" but whose doctrines/policies/practices/-/-/ derive from regional customs and beliefs. Any religion that claims to have a god with universal authority and power and to love all humanity MUST have an equally universal presence in ALL people groups and regions FROM THE BEGINNING. 

Otherwise it is just school kids arguing about what color their soccer ball should be...

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3 hours ago, JoeMo said:

If Allah is the same god as Yahweh or Jehovah, why does he call for the death of all Christians and Jews; and call Friday the Sabbath?

IMO, Allah does none of those things. The "Allah" of the Muslim religion does not exist. The call for death is made by human beings who are pretending to heed the call of their imaginary god.

I don't  believe any of the so-called "false gods" are actual beings. They are figments of the imagination of their adherents. Zeus didn't exist. Hercules didn't exist. Athena didn't exist. Baal didn't exist. Apollo didn't exist. Zarathustra didn't exist. The "Great Spirit" doesn't exist. None of the 33 million Hindu gods exist. And Allah doesn't exist.

But if one is going to consider different conceptions of God as "different gods", then one must conclude that the Calvinists worship a different god from the Lutherans since the Calvinist god has predestined some men to hell while the Lutheran god has done no such thing. The Lutheran god is present in the Eucharist while the SDA god is not. So SDAs worship a different god from the Lutherans. The SDA god has been working hard in the temple for the last 175 years while the evangelical god finished His work on the cross - so SDAs worship a different god from that of the evangelicals.  The arian SDA pioneers must certainly have worshiped a different god from that of the later trinitarian SDAs.

But getting back to the Islamic god - is there any evidence anywhere that the "allah" of the Islamic religion even exists?

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37 minutes ago, pierrepaul said:

But getting back to the Islamic god - is there any evidence anywhere that the "allah" of the Islamic religion even exists?

Two comments on that:

1. What would you accept as legitimate evidence for/against the existence of the Islamic "allah?"

2. Do we also apply the criteria above to the Judeo/Christian "god?"

I find it curious, and highly improbable, that of the "33 million +"  gods created from the imaginations of the adherents, YOURS is the ONE TRUE GOD.

Whereas in the past I subscribed to that theology, I now no longer do.

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I also found it highly improbable that (a) attaining the "truth" would depend upon solving a cryptic puzzle hidden in the Bible; (b) such "truth" would be unavailable to the vast vast majority of humanity; and (c) not only was I born into Christianity, whose God is real, but I was born into a tiny sect with its own special prophet, who alone, unlike the rest of Christianity and the rest of humanity, possesses the secret "truth".

EGW's "prophecies" about the papacy, the sunday law and things like that can only be understood in the context of the virulent anti-Catholic views and attitudes rampant in Anglo-saxon protestant circles of the USA in the early-mid 19th century. Coupled with the religious effervescence in New England and upstate New York at the time, one can begin to understand how the "standard" SDA eschatology arose. But to ascribe any prophetic truth to Uriah Smith's, EGW's and their fellow travellers' fanciful musings about a "Sunday law" is taking it a little too far.

 

 

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6 hours ago, pierrepaul said:

I also found it highly improbable that (a) attaining the "truth" would depend upon solving a cryptic puzzle hidden in the Bible;

I agree.  IMHO, all of our meager attempts to unravel unfulfilled prophecy  is merely speculation.  We will KNOW when prophecy is fulfilled because it will unfold right before our eyes.  The church 2,000 years ago was unable to unravel the prophecies of Christ's first coming; so what makes us think that we are sufficiently "enlightened" to unravel the prophecies of His Second Coming. I firmly believe that He IS coming; and coming SOON (like the next 10 - 15 years); but I don't have a clue exactly how it will happen. Lots of plausible scenarios out there though!

Another thing,  there are some things in scripture that are crystal clear (like Jesus is God; in the beginning God created everything); Jesus lived an exemplary life and died to pay the penalty for our sins.  I believe these crystal clear things are crystal clear because they are necessary for salvation.  Other things are very cryptic or allegorical (like is Michael really the pre-incarnate Christ? Is strictly keeping Sabbath necessary for salvation?  Will Sunday keeping send you to hell? is there realla an ever-burning hell for the wicked). Some of these things may have some theological value; but getting 100% on a theology test isn't what saves you - Faith in who Jesus is and what He has done and will do for us is what saves us.

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